Incapacity to ESA Put in WRAG without a medical?

Moderators: *Lisa*, shazq, denys, loubie, helen virgo, FluppyPuffy, janham

Incapacity to ESA Put in WRAG without a medical?

Postby mandy » Fri Dec 23, 2011 5:46 pm

At the beginning of November I had to fill in the dreaded form to switch from Incapacity to ESA.

This morning I received a letter saying that I had been placed in the Work-Related Activity Group and that I will have to take part in work focussed interviews and may be required to attend a work-focussed health-related assessment.

My first question is is it usual to be put in this group without having had to attend a medical?

I telephoned them to ask for details on how many points I scored, how they arrived at their decision and to check that they asked my GP for a letter as I requested on my form.

After a number of phone calls I eventually got a call back from them and was told I had not been assessed on the points system as there was sufficient information on my form for them to arrive at their decision. He then went on to tell me not to worry as nearly everyone is in the WRAG group. He said it is just the same as Incapacity Benefit and that only terminally ill people are put in the support group!! When I asked if the decision maker had obtained a report from my GP, as I requested, he couldn't tell me.

I told him I wasn't happy with the outcome and am worried what will happen as I am on contribution based ESA, so in 12 months (or 182 days as the booklet states) I will get nothing as my husband is working and it is means tested. I asked for a detailed written report on how they had arrived at the decision and he said he would send me a copy of their report, but it was only about half a page of notes and brief. How can I argue their points, if I don't know how they have arrived at the decision. All he kept saying was there was enough information on my form for them not to have arrived at the decision without having to see me. Now I wish I hadn't been as detailed.

Like so many other's on here I can't see how they have arrived at their conclusion and am prepared to appeal if necessary. I know I have the full support of my GP and if they did contact her, she would have given me a good report.

As far as I can see I now have to wait for them to send me the copy of their decision maker's notes, then ask for a reconsideration. They if I am still unhappy I have to send in an Appeal.

I would be really grateful for any advice.

Happy Christmas to everyone, they have just made certain I won't be having a Happy Christmas :(
mandy
UKFM Newbie
 
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 3:27 am

Re: Incapacity to ESA Put in WRAG without a medical?

Postby FluppyPuffy » Fri Dec 23, 2011 6:01 pm

I asked then to send me all the stuff relating to my claim as they put me in WRAG as well, and that was at the beginning of November. I'm still waiting for the info to come thru, altho I have had a letter to tell me it has gone for reconsideration. As my letter said I didn't want it to go for reconsideration, but straight into the appeals process, it just shows they don't even read what is sent to them :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
As a Public Moderator of this forum my opinions/views expressed are personal and are no more valid than those of other members and not necessarily those of UKFibromyalgia.

If your dog doesn't like someone, then you probably shouldn't either
User avatar
FluppyPuffy
MODERATOR
 
Posts: 16263
Joined: Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:25 am
Location: Living Life On The Edge.......Of The Norty Step!!!

Re: Incapacity to ESA Put in WRAG without a medical?

Postby denys » Fri Dec 23, 2011 6:05 pm

He has given you some duff info, its not only terminally ill people put into the support group some on here have. Not many granted but some so he was wrong there. He should have been able to tell you if they had got the doctors report but from the sound of it they havent bothered. Tell them you intend to appeal and therefore need copies of all the information you have given them as you may have to inform them in writing not sure really anyway :goodluck2: and :fingerscrossed:
Denys x

As a Public Moderator of this forum my opinions/views expressed are personal and are no more valid than those of other members and not necessarily those of UKFibromyalgia.
User avatar
denys
MODERATOR
 
Posts: 15020
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2010 10:05 pm

Re: Incapacity to ESA Put in WRAG without a medical?

Postby mandy » Fri Dec 23, 2011 6:57 pm

Thanks for your replies. I got the impression he was rushing as he was due to finish at 4.30pm. It wasn't my fault that he only rang me at 4.10pm when I had been expecting a call from 11.00am.

Am I right in thinking that if I am in the Contribution Based WRAG I will only receive ESA for a maximum of 12 months? He was trying to tell me that it would be reviewed every 182 days.

Please could someone please explain why most people seem to just go straight for an Appeal and not bother asking for a Reconsideration?
mandy
UKFM Newbie
 
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 3:27 am

Re: Incapacity to ESA Put in WRAG without a medical?

Postby fmguy » Fri Dec 23, 2011 7:26 pm

Hi Mandy
You need to ask them, well or should I say insist if needed they send you the medical report, you need to ask them for your ESA85 report and also ask them to send you an appeal form GLA24 then you can see just what they have said about you most you will find will be pure fantasy to be polite or lies depending how you judge untruths. with this you can then counter their arguments as to why the came up with your decision for the WRAG otherwise it's a bit like being in court and not knowing the charges made against you and then trying to defend your self.

You should ask for these from the office that sent your ESA decision to you, let them know on the phone you are appealing the decision for the WRAG you have one month only from the dated on the ESA decision you have to gather more evidence and state your case and get the GLA24 back to them make sure you send it recorded delivery the you have proof of the date you posted it. The GLA24 form is useless space wise so use extra sheets with your name and national insurance number on them I would staple them to the form as well as they do like losing stuff.

They tend to tell everyone not to bother appealing for the support group and the dying stuff it's not true lots of people get their decision overturned in there favour for the support group and some with Fibromyagia so it can be done with a good case if you feel you can go through the appeal process and such.
When you appeal it automatically gets reviewed first by the decision maker the if they do not have a change of heart it the gets sent for appeal which you will attend usually and you can get help from the CAB or Welfare right people at your local council who may be able to attend with you.

Do not bother with just having your decision looked at again as they may suggest or you have to then start appealing if they do not change their minds, as I said they do this automatically with the appeal process.

Keep copies of everything you write including what you put on any the forms also try not to use the phone to deal with more than you have too as in writing you have proof of what was said

Remember they may sound nice and genuine on the phone at the job centre or DWP some can be trusted but most sadly can not I find.
The best site for help is the Benefits And Work website you will find lots of help on there to help you decide if you want to appeal.

Hope this helps you a little I am also sending you a private message
Guy
fmguy
UKFM Newbie
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2011 7:12 pm
Location: Fylde Coast

Re: Incapacity to ESA Put in WRAG without a medical?

Postby FluppyPuffy » Fri Dec 23, 2011 10:14 pm

fmguy wrote:Hi Mandy
You need to ask them, well or should I say insist if needed they send you the medical report, you need to ask them for your ESA85 report and also ask them to send you an appeal form GLA24.....

.....Do not bother with just having your decision looked at again as they may suggest or you have to then start appealing if they do not change their minds, as I said they do this automatically with the appeal process.


It isn't necessary to wait for the GLA24 form, a letter saying that you will be appealing the decision is acceptable, as stated in all the paperwork and guff that came with my advice of fate letter.

The thing about it only being paid for 12 months hasn't gone thru yet, it is being looked at and considered at the moment, I was told when I went for my WFI at the start of the month.

As for going straight into the appeal process instead of going for the reconsideration, they may not take any notice of that request. In my letter, it was clearly stated that I didn't want mine to go thru the reconsideration part, yet they have disregarded what I asked for and still done it any way.

They truly are a law unto themselves and make their own rules up as they go along :swear1: :swear1: :swear1: :swear1: :swear1:
As a Public Moderator of this forum my opinions/views expressed are personal and are no more valid than those of other members and not necessarily those of UKFibromyalgia.

If your dog doesn't like someone, then you probably shouldn't either
User avatar
FluppyPuffy
MODERATOR
 
Posts: 16263
Joined: Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:25 am
Location: Living Life On The Edge.......Of The Norty Step!!!

Re: Incapacity to ESA Put in WRAG without a medical?

Postby sjc » Fri Dec 23, 2011 10:41 pm

Hi there. Hope you are ok. I am in similar situation with being migranted from one sick benefit to another. It does cause alot of stress and confusion. I was on income support and in november, i got the ea50 medical questionnaire from atos. Because i provided atos reasonable evidence and a detailed information in the questionnaire, they have said i do not have to go to a medical assessment. This is good for me because i hate medical assessments. Done them in the past when on income support, and they are awful. Now, i am awaiting the decision from the jobcentre to see if they gonna put me on esa, and what group will i fall into. Most people do go into the wrag group. The support group are for those with really serious and sometimes long term conditions. Tbh, you maybe lucky and get in support group, but you need to show that your conditions are really serious enough. Hopefully you will get the results you want. Keep strong and keep fighting, even though things are tough sometimes. Have a nice xmas.
Sick of being sick, if you know what I mean. Anger keeps me going! I love campaigning for the rights of those with hidden disabilities. Enjoys talking to other like minded people - well, if you are sane, anyway :)
User avatar
sjc
UKFM Member
 
Posts: 291
Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2010 8:58 pm
Location: East Midlands, Uk

Re: Incapacity to ESA Put in WRAG without a medical?

Postby FluppyPuffy » Sat Dec 24, 2011 11:25 am

Mandy, definitely start putting things into motion if you can for an appeal. I had another dreaded brown envelope drop thru the door and couldn't believe what it said (made me wonder if it was April's Fool Day :shock: :shock: ) They have relooked at my claim and changed the decision and put me in the Support Group :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

There are a few up there with something resembling humanity and common sense, so hopefully there will be a few more reports about sensible decisions being made :fingerscrossed: :fingerscrossed:
As a Public Moderator of this forum my opinions/views expressed are personal and are no more valid than those of other members and not necessarily those of UKFibromyalgia.

If your dog doesn't like someone, then you probably shouldn't either
User avatar
FluppyPuffy
MODERATOR
 
Posts: 16263
Joined: Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:25 am
Location: Living Life On The Edge.......Of The Norty Step!!!

Re: Incapacity to ESA Put in WRAG without a medical?

Postby golden_delight1980 » Sat Dec 24, 2011 1:57 pm

I look forward to my appeal and intend to make them look stupid. I am going to consistently send letters to the David Cameron and his team if my appeal is refused and willing to go to the media. I am sick of these muppets ruining peoples lives whilst the dole scum and immigrants drain the money pots.
golden_delight1980
UKFM Member
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2011 12:57 pm

Re: Incapacity to ESA Put in WRAG without a medical?

Postby FluppyPuffy » Sat Dec 24, 2011 3:34 pm

Golden_delight, whilst there are those on the dole who will try to milk the system for all it's worth, there are many more who have found themselves in the position of having to claim benefit thru no fault of their own. Maybe exercising a little mindfulness rather than tarring everyone with the same brush might be a more suitable approach.
As a Public Moderator of this forum my opinions/views expressed are personal and are no more valid than those of other members and not necessarily those of UKFibromyalgia.

If your dog doesn't like someone, then you probably shouldn't either
User avatar
FluppyPuffy
MODERATOR
 
Posts: 16263
Joined: Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:25 am
Location: Living Life On The Edge.......Of The Norty Step!!!

Re: Incapacity to ESA Put in WRAG without a medical?

Postby denys » Sat Dec 24, 2011 3:38 pm

We need to be careful not to brand everyone the same as that is exactly what people are doing with regard to the disabled/people on benefits especially the media, not everyone is looking to cheat and defraud the system as is portrayed in the press :nono:
Denys x

As a Public Moderator of this forum my opinions/views expressed are personal and are no more valid than those of other members and not necessarily those of UKFibromyalgia.
User avatar
denys
MODERATOR
 
Posts: 15020
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2010 10:05 pm

Re: Incapacity to ESA Put in WRAG without a medical?

Postby Ldyalb » Sat Dec 24, 2011 4:45 pm

A lot of people on JSA will be disabled too, just not eligible for ESA if they're disabled, but not too disabled for work. I met loads at Microsoft when I did a placement there through Remploy this year, there were people with Autism, Downs Syndrome, Dyslexia, Dyspraxia, Tourettes, Fibro, Cerebral Palsy, Anaemia etc who were all under 25, disabled and looking for work.

Lots of non disabled people have lost their jobs recently, and I think it's actually 1 million under 25s who are unemployed. I know people who graduated before I did and still haven't been able to find a job :(

I know that a few years ago disabled people were over twice as likely to be unemployed as non-disabled people, same with disabled graduates. Yet 1 in 7 adults of working age in the UK has a disability or long-term health condition.

Sadly if there's not enough jobs for the healthy it's harder for those of us who do have disabilities to find work. But it's hard for them too. I'm not sure on the statistics for the pop. as a whole but before the 2011 Graduates graduated there were 375,000 graduates chasing... 75,000 jobs. 300,000 are going to be disappointed.

What we need is for businesses to be given more incentives to employ and retain those of us who may be able to do some work, instead of regarding reasonable adjustments as a massive pain in the backside. And then the government need to be realistic about who can, and who cannot work. give proper support to those who can't at all, and to those who may be able to do some work, but without the ridiculous 12 month rule for contributions WRAG.

I think when Labour first started trying to get people off IB in to work in 1999 people had 12 months in which they could leave their job and return to their old benefit level straight away if they found they couldn't cope. I think that's a good idea, means people are safe to go and try something if they feel they might be able to do it, but without punishing them if it doesn't work out.
'Think of all the beauty still left around you and be happy' - Anne Frank

TMJ, RLS, HMS, Fibro, Dyspraxia - ASD + Dyscalculia overlap, Eczema + Rosacea + suspected Psoriatic Arthritis.

Being an Adult is nothing like it said in the brochure...!
User avatar
Ldyalb
UKFM Regular
 
Posts: 1668
Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 6:46 pm
Location: Lincolnshire


Return to DWP, Working & Benefits

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 8 guests